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:Alan Cox: W3C Patent Policy: Bad for the W3C, bad for business, bad for users
Alan Cox: W3C Patent Policy: Bad for the W3C, bad for business, bad for users
Sep 30, 2001, 16 :49 UTC (29 Talkback[s]) (20841 reads)

Subject: W3C Patent Policy: Bad for the W3C, bad for business, bad for users
To: www-patentpolicy-comment@w3.org
Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2001 15:42:01 +0100 (BST)


"The W3C was created to lead the Web to its full potential by developing
 common protocols that promote its evolution and ensure its
 interoperability"

A lofty and great goal. A pity that the W3C now proposes to throw away its
very reason for existence. 

And now we have a new much abused patent politics buzzword

"Non-discriminatory"

Indeed.

I think the W3C should ask itself how allowing parties to use patents to
prevent community projects for blind access is "non-discriminatory".

Tim Berners Lee created an innovative environment about sharing and
referencing data. You plan to give large companies the power to stifle
that innovation.

It says something for the sad state of W3C that the proposal in question
has been allowed to progress, carefully arranged not to be visible to
the outside world. The dates of the short consultation period do not even 
appear to have been adjusted in the light of September 11th. The proposed 
shortening of the consultation period also appears to violate the W3C 
rules, but then I am sure you don't care. I can smell the rot from here.

A patent-encumbered web threatens the very freedom of intellectual debate,
allowing only large companies and big media houses to present information
in certain ways. Imagine where the web would be now if only large companies
were able to use image files.

And large companies it is. I note the distinct lack of small companies on
the proposal in question. Within the ISO where the same things happen the
money simply moves in circles between big players. Accountants and lawyers
pay $100,000 sums back and forth as part of an accounting game that they
use to keep out smaller players.

I think we can also be sure that the kind of W3C members working this
little agenda have plans. I would bet on "Windows digitally-protected 
uncopyable web pages" being one of them. Of course the protection they
really mean is "against reading by non IE users".

The W3C must ask itself whether it plans to continue the vision of Tim or 
become another ITU, a bloated dinosaur that exists more as a corporate United
Nations of communication than a standards body. 

If the W3C wishes to remain relevant to the people, to the small businesses
(the other 80%) and to the future of the web then I strongly suggest that it

o       Requires non-disclosed patents are freely licensed for use
        in that standard for all. 

Without this a key infrastructure standard may suddenely be "owned" by a W3C 
member who intentionally kept quiet to gain "non discriminatory" - but large -
license fees. The current wording encourages patent abuse. Licensing on a 
RAND basis would only be appropriate for such a non-disclosed patent if
existing RAND licenses were on that proposal before final consultantion.
Regardless of the rest of the outcome all honest members will benefit from 
such a stricter policy on non-disclosure of patents.

o       Does not "approve" or "recommend" or allow its logo to be used
        on any patent-encumbered item.

To do so will tarnish the value and reputation of the W3C name and logo. It
will also create confusion about what W3C standards indicate. 

o       Restricts its activities on patent-encumbered projects to providing a 
        forum where such people can work on patent encumbered projects to be 
        released under their own names only. 

Here its activities would be in a consultative role, helping to guide these 
bodies in areas of overall standards compliance and interpretation of W3C 
goals. It is possible to further the web standardisation goal without
becoming part of those activities that are contrary to the original goals
of the W3C.

This would mean SVG became a multi-vendor consortium pushing a private
specification. But let's face it - with the patents involved - that is 
precisely what it is. It may even be appropriate for SVG work to be 
transferred to the ITU.

Finally we should all remember this. When patented W3C standards ensure
there is only one web browser in the world, its owners will no longer
have time for the W3C or standards.

Alan


Index Mode   |   Flat Mode   |   Thread Mode   |   Thread Flat  
  Talkback(s) Name  and Date

Well said!

--
csm ...   Go Alan!   
Chuck Mead
Sep 30, 2001, 17:05:49
 
Since the W3C is a vendor consortium, I  ...   vendor consortium   
AnonCow
Sep 30, 2001, 17:51:50
 
I definitely agree with everything Alan  ...   License audits and Monopoly creation   
Alan H
Sep 30, 2001, 18:32:36
 
RAND, in Hindi means 'Prostitute&#39 ...   Totally OT, but   
shaunak
Sep 30, 2001, 18:38:59
 
I couldn't say it better even if I t ...   Alan rocks, well said!   
Leo
Sep 30, 2001, 18:42:57
 
It was after 9PM when I read their annou ...   Thanks for standing up to them!   
David D. Huff Jr.
Sep 30, 2001, 18:45:32
 

Who in his right mind thinks that he c ...   Patients growing even more stupid ?   
Fred Mobach
Sep 30, 2001, 19:37:21
 
> 
> Well said!
> 
> --
> csm


I ...   Re: Go Alan!   
Gary Rutter
Sep 30, 2001, 20:19:40
 
>We should create a new internet standar ...   Re: vendor consortium   
Gary Rutter
Sep 30, 2001, 20:22:16
 
I dont get it -why do W3C want to allow  ...   W3C corrupt? (Go Alan!)   
CTO: Henrik B. Steffensen
Sep 30, 2001, 20:23:01
 
> RAND, in Hindi means 'Prostitute&# ...   Re: Totally OT, but   
Gary Rutter
Sep 30, 2001, 20:27:40
 
>I think it's time to dismantle W3C  ...   Re: Alan rocks, well said!   
Gary Rutter
Sep 30, 2001, 20:36:35
 
OUTRAGEOUS!!!  This isn't just sleaz ...   What A Crock!   
Tim
Sep 30, 2001, 21:07:35
 
An excellent analysis.
Mark ...   Eloquent, passionate and precise   
Mark Kent
Sep 30, 2001, 21:54:19
 
Looking at their purpose for existence ( ...   shot to the foot?   
David Lane
Oct 1, 2001, 00:09:04
 
> As if Eben Moglen has no comment about ...   Re: Alan rocks, well said!   
Karl Jackson
Oct 1, 2001, 00:39:54
 
Anyone ever hear of the www-ng group? Th ...   WWW-NG   
chillywilly
Oct 1, 2001, 01:28:36
 
Let me say it, too. Thanks for speaking  ...   Thanks, Alan   
Theodore Kilgore
Oct 1, 2001, 01:54:48
 
Thank you Alan.
It is so gratifiying to ...   Stand against M$ WWW domineering.   
Chris Wakefield
Oct 1, 2001, 02:53:42
 
 RAND, in Hindi means 'Prostitute&#3 ...   Re: Totally OT, but   
Peter Bradley
Oct 1, 2001, 07:09:37
 
Alan makes some very good points about t ...   Well said, but some flaws   
Chris Lilley
Oct 1, 2001, 09:28:43
 
Oh - I notice that Alan suggests 

  & ...   What was that about SVG?   
Chris Lilley
Oct 1, 2001, 09:57:26
 
Thank you Alan

I sent my reply to the ...   Thank you   
Samuel SCHMIDT
Oct 1, 2001, 11:03:49
 
I believe it is essentially dishonest fo ...   Standards and non-standards   
David Sugar
Oct 1, 2001, 13:30:16
 
If this issue fails, the W3C will be scr ...   Look at the bright side . . .   
Dave
Oct 1, 2001, 15:04:30
 
 Oh - I notice that Alan suggests 
>    ...   Re: What was that about SVG?   
Toby Haynes
Oct 1, 2001, 16:08:11
 
By allowing patented protocols, the W3C  ...   W3C ? Standards? I guess not.   
Charles Hixson
Oct 1, 2001, 22:02:26
 
>  Oh - I notice that Alan suggests 
[. ...   Re: Re: What was that about SVG?   
Donovan Baarda
Oct 4, 2001, 02:11:47
 
I suggest that we put the matter in 3 to ...   W3C Patent Policy   
Sudhir Gandotra
Oct 5, 2001, 15:22:56
 
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